Smoking Banned Outdoors,and At Home

miketafc

Prowling Primate
SMOKING BANNED OUTDOORS,AND AT HOME

The new year has seen two instances of smoking restrictions
going further than ever before.
As lovers of the leaf are being banished from the indoors
worldwide, in some places in the United States they are now
prohibited from smoking outdoors and, in one instance,
smoking cost several people their jobs.

WOW This is really getting rediculous, where does it stop. The article also states companies that are requiring brethalizers and firing people who smoke.

Your taughts?

If you would like the whole article PM me and I'll send you a Mic Word copy or copy it here to the forum.
 
I heard something like that on the radio a couple of days ago Private employers argue that smokers cause them to pay more for health insurance. Part of me says "Okay, a private employer can make any rules they want."

BUT what about obese people? How about those who have a history of cancer in their families? How about those who have children? Those are examples of people who will certainly incur far more expensive health insurance claims than smokers in the long run.

Employers using this as an excuse is definately not right. I hope someone brings legal action against employers who pull this nonsense.
 
CoventryCat86 said:
I heard something like that on the radio a couple of days ago Private employers argue that smokers cause them to pay more for health insurance. Part of me says "Okay, a private employer can make any rules they want."

BUT what about obese people? How about those who have a history of cancer in their families? How about those who have children? Those are examples of people who will certainly incur far more expensive health insurance claims than smokers in the long run.

Employers using this as an excuse is definately not right. I hope someone brings legal action against employers who pull this nonsense.


The law definitely needs to be changed...

First, smoking outdoors. That's just rediculous. Considering the amount of polution everyone has to deal with on a day to day basis due to these large corporations and car exhaust, not to mention the forest fires, and the guy b-b-q'ing out in the back yard.... It's just rediculous.

In the home? Well that's completely retarded and comes right up against privacy laws that insure your right to privacy.

In the workplace? I'm sorry, This is like attacking a symptom and forgetting about the problem, which is our failing health care system.

Some states protect smokers under various (lifestyle) laws, and honestly i'm a bit shocked that Florida DOESN'T, due to the amount of tourists they have coming into the state each year, you would think they would be a bit more lenient. But they're not.


It's really sad, actually. Honestly, it's an invasion of privacy... It's one thing for an employee to ban smoking on their property, that should be within their rights... But banning people from smoking at home? This is probably against the law under the Right To Privacy laws we have here in the united states. It's just a matter of someone sueing over it and winning.

I realize there is a health insurance crisis in the country, and that it stems from hospitals trying to see bigger and better profits each year, (meanwhile their workers continue to be underpaid for the work that they do.) This in turn translates over to rising health insurance costs. (which in turn translates to crappier and crappier insurance.) But this kind of thing makes me think about our slogan (Land of the Free) and laugh or cry, depending on my mood.

Honestly, I think countries like England, and perhaps even Japan offer more freedoms to their people than we do these days. And we're supposed to be "The Land of the Free".... I know they offer a better quality of Television programming. :p

What a joke. America has become a nation of hypocrites, in many more ways than one over the last 3 decades or so.


IMO: If they're going to do this, then eventually people who are overweight will suffer as well. Then comes people who drink, then comes people who are ACTIVE and like to go sky-diving, mountain climbing, etc.

Pretty soon you'll find that only about 10% of the population can hold down a job, or be insurable. And that will basically be the yuppie population.. The ones who think getting on a treadmill for 45 minutes is a good outdoor activity. :)

I realize that America is still a great country, but it bothers me that Americans have let slip so many of the laws and rights that have protected them for so long, by becoming lethargic and thinking that "The Government Knows Best."


We need some kind of pro-smoking coalition.. The Right To Smoke or something.... Basically the equivelent to the NRA, before we're all forced to become drones or leave.
 
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Isn't it amazing Corporate America trying to create a safer environment for their employees? By eliminating smoking from the workplace and home too!

Before the emphasis was on product,quality and quanity.Instead of killing its employees slowly with toxins.My grand father was killed in a coal mine in 1946 and my dad was seriously injured(he got out after that).What had a large role in dad dying was the coal dust he breathed while in the mines. It now wants to regulate both the workplace and what you can do at home, for your own health? No so it doesn't have to pay for anything you might get from a fellow employee that smokes or what you smoke at home.. Is farting next??? I work with at least 2 guys that emit toxic fumes on a regular basis. Not making lite of the subject matter,but its just about as silly.

Much like our judicial system our health care system just simply doesn't work. IMHO.
 
I definitely want to see the actual article.

Smoking banned "at home"!?

Please. I have to see that to believe it. You think there just might be a constitutional issue there? There simply has to be more to it than that, as there is no way the government can ban you from smoking at your own home.
 
The smoking banned at home was tried in Montgomery County Maryland....but didn't last. Maybe some place else tried.

This is not new btw. When I was at CNN in 86, Ted decided to have us sign forms that said we did not smoke and they could infact search our cars for cigs. Oh yeah and it f you were spotted with a styrofoam cup it was grounds for immediate dismissal. (He was dating Jane then and Captain Planet was the rage.) Needless to say I left.

As for England, they are tlaking about a national smoking ban. It is the Euro Nazis who have latched onto smoking as an evil. But note NONE of the countrys have banned tobacco nor its high taxes they levy on it. Hypocrites. They want the tax money but don't allow a legal product to be consumed.
 
Lets try and get organized with this. A few months ago I used the letter that JR or Holts gave out and sent it to my senator and representative. Anyone now of other letters that we can send to our congressmen?

I want to know who are these people that are trying to enact all of these laws? They are the minority. Unfortunately they are a very vocal minority. If we don't speak up louder than they, are voices will never get heard.

Jeff
 
Rob T said:
I definitely want to see the actual article.

Smoking banned "at home"!?

Please. I have to see that to believe it. You think there just might be a constitutional issue there? There simply has to be more to it than that, as there is no way the government can ban you from smoking at your own home.


I don't have the article but it's been posted on the ASC newsgroup, and from what I read it is actually LEGAL on a federal level for employers to fire you for smoking at home, and it IS actually LEGAL for them to drug test you for it.

I think it was 18 states that had modified their laws to protect smokers, under some varying "Lifestyle" protection laws that each state has enacted. Louisiana, where I came from, was one of those states... And Florida was not.

The article that I had actually seen and read involved one employer who was also trying to push out his overweight employees as well, but because overweight people are protected under discrimination laws, all he could do was offer company vouchers to a health club, and incentives for them to lose the weight, this article only mentioned his previous ban on smokers in an offhand way, Citing that 4 employees quit, to avoid being fired for smoking.


The site that listed it was something like managementcomplaints.com or something very similar to that, and appeared to mostly have articles based on management issues in the UK, but this particular article was about a US based small company.

I was floored to find out it was LEGAL for them to do such a thing, but apparently it is. At least in all but 18 states.


Ok I just found the one I read...

-------------------------------------

Shape up or ship out

28 January 2005 | Management Issues


The boss of a US company who forced his employees to give up smoking or quit their job has turned his attention to the waistlines of his workforce, warning oversize staff to lose weight or face the consequences.

Four employees at Michigan-based health insurer Weyco quit their jobs last week after owner Howard Weyers banned tobacco use at home or at work and insisted that staff take a mandatory urine test.

"If they don't want to take the test, they can leave," Weyers said. "I'm not controlling their lives; they have a choice whether they want to work here."

Now Weyers has brought in eating disorder therapists and devised a bonus system that gives staff a $45 monthly voucher for health club membership and other bonuses if they meet fitness targets.

"The goal is to encourage employees to become healthier and to increase their ability to accomplish more, both personally and professionally," he said.

But luckily for his workforce, incentives are all that Mr Weyers can use in his battle to fight the flab. Because while forcing out smokers with tests to detect tobacco is legal in the USA. firing people for being fat is not.



http://www.management-issues.com/display_page.asp?section=blog&search=1&id=1849
 
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Jokieman has sited a different paper, but the same info on the ban on home smoking at Weyco. The article I have is rather lenghty and is from Cigar Insider that also lists quite a few states, especially California, that are banning smoking in public places. They are aimed at cigarette smokers, but we get punished along with them.

I would like to have someone post the letter that we can send to our reps in congress and the Senate and encourage everyone to start getting active.
 
Several people who smoke at my job hide that fact because they are afraid that they will be looked down upon. Personally, I think it's rediculous that people have lost their jobs over it, and with all these restrictions, it makes you wonder what's next. When I used to chew on a regular basis, I hid that fact simply because I was the only one doing it. As it relates to cigar smoking, I don't care who knows, but I still know people who choose to treat it as a big secret and hide their smoking from everyone. I say light up if it makes you happy, and be damn proud of it.
 
I cannot help but read this thread and agree with most every point on here. In a society that attempts to be so "anti-discrimination" and accepting of so many different ideals/cultures, how can they then fire people because they smoke and require breathalizers? If they are doing this for health insurance reasons, then what is to stop them from NOT hiring people w/ family/ethnic histories of health concerns. Such as history of cancer in the family, or a certain ethnicity has higher rate for a certain disease or you can go on and on.

It sometimes does seem that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Random people can come up w/ ideas that the majority of the country doesn't agree with, but if they can convince the leaders of it's "value", then that distinct minority will gain control.

I highly doubt that the majority of our nation wants to get breathalizered at work to see if they've smoked. I bet over 95% find that rediculous, so it is time that we speak out if this is going to take place.

Where do I need to sign?
 
You would be surprised, there are a few other countries that offer more freedoms than we do now. America is rapidly becoming an over regulated police state. The only true freedom we have anymore is to be consumers and spend $$$ to fund the corps. :pu
 
As for indoors, I'll respect what people want and the law. Outside, nobody tells me what to do, not even me.
 
Jeff said:
You would be surprised, there are a few other countries that offer more freedoms than we do now. America is rapidly becoming an over regulated police state. The only true freedom we have anymore is to be consumers and spend $$$ to fund the corps. :pu


Yeah, I tend to agree with that. Every year we tell ourselves (it's still a great country to live in.) And granted, it is, but every year we lose more and more freedoms to these Weenies who want the government to run and structure everyone's lives.

Yet Corporations are being given more and more freedoms to pollute the air, break child labor laws, run sweatshops outside of the country, allow hospitals to offer substandard care and be protected by the government for it, and we as citizens take it all in stride... And it's Disgusting.

Every single year since the age of 20, I've seen at least 1 freedom that's guaranteed to us by the Constitution of the United States of America, either taken away, or raped by political entities.. Be it on the city, state, or federal levels.

Money runs this country, and the money lies with the corporations who spend billions every year lobbying for what they want.


Our country, in many ways, is less free than others in Europe are right now, IMO. As it is, I gotta read their newspapers to get the truth about what's going on here in america. hehe. And you'd be surprised at how much WE are not told by our supposedly "Free" press...
 
I work in an industry, Aviation Maintenance in case you have not figured it out, that-without having any published reports to prove it- roughly 50% smoke. Aviation Maintenance is a streesful environment and with all of the regulations that can get a tech in trouble, techs turn to smoking. Non-Smokers are the minority at my Hanger. They get clobbered if they speak up too loudly-verbally, not physically. My Crew Chief's wife is from Belgium and says that the" Land of the Free" has more restrictions than anything she has seen in Europe. I have been watching this develop and concernd about all of the anti-smoking regulations that are being enacted around this country. Trying to discuss the rights of smokers with non-smokers is like talking religion, politics or abortion, very dangerous ground. I look forward to voicing and voting in the interst of the leaf. :sb
 
I feel the transgressions on smokers rights are ridiculous....but that seems to be general sentimate here, so rather than just repeat my views of excess federal burecracy and control I have a question:

Much of the recent legislation deals with smoking in bars or restaurants....does this legislation apply to a cigar bar? If a cigar store also sells food/drink is it subject to these new laws? What if someones livelyhood depends on their operation of said cigar lounge/bar?

-kyle
 
JustAyoungMC said:
I feel the transgressions on smokers rights are ridiculous....but that seems to be general sentimate here, so rather than just repeat my views of excess federal burecracy and control I have a question:

Much of the recent legislation deals with smoking in bars or restaurants....does this legislation apply to a cigar bar? If a cigar store also sells food/drink is it subject to these new laws? What if someones livelyhood depends on their operation of said cigar lounge/bar?

-kyle

Here is a link that summarizes state smoking laws:
http://www.smokefreeworld.com/usa.shtml

Since it's state by state it's hard to answer in general.
Most states now have laws banning smoking in the workplace including restaurants and bars with some exceptions for bars, private clubs, or cigar bars.

However this is no joke. We have to pass laws to protect us from being fired for smoking in the home.
EMPLOYEE PROTECTION

New York State is one of many states that enacted law to protect workers, smokers among them, from being fired due to engaging in legal off-hours activities. New York State employees are fortunate in this respect. There are states that can refuse to hire you or choose to fire you if you smoke even while you are at home. Be aware of what your rights are.
 
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